I will give you this

To follow up on this, at least in your version it doesn't have two straight sentences of "played" and "played" like in my articles. "Ryan Bee (born November 12, 1995) is an American former professional football defensive end who played for the Washington Redskins of the National Football League (NFL). He played college football at Marshall. He was also a member of the Arizona Cardinals." Yours is less redundant.

I'm probably not going to personally go around changing them though since I know people like Yankees10 and Bluerules might get mad at me, lol. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 13:36, 12 June 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: There was/is some editor who changed "football player who was a defensive end" to "football player who played defensive end". —Bagumba (talk) 07:09, 13 June 2026 (UTC)

"football player who played defensive end" Yuck. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 18:11, 17 June 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9 for your to-do list. lol. —Bagumba (talk) 07:40, 21 June 2026 (UTC)

I already tried fixing that before, but Bluerules just adds it back. "Edit war" appears on his talk page 51 times. That's not even including what he deletes without archiving Facepalm ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:11, 22 June 2026 (UTC)

***hole . ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:36, 2 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Then there's this. —Bagumba (talk) 22:25, 2 July 2026 (UTC)

Nikkimaria can't make up his or her mind on how they want to do the leads. Sometimes, it's "American former football player. A quarterback, he played" ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:18, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

Did you know that saying Brady won 7 Super Bowls in the lead is "completely unnecessary"? It's basically the same thing as having his pet cat in the lead. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 16:45, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

I guess it was already in the lead: "and won Super Bowl LV, extending his individual records to ten Super Bowl appearances and seven victories" ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 16:55, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Yeah, not like he won the Bill Willis Trophy. —Bagumba (talk) 16:56, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

Y10 my hero. Of course, Bluerules just added it back like he always does. Something needs to be done about him. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:05, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: What did you have in mind? —Bagumba (talk) 17:12, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

I don't think I'm going to do anything at the moment... but I'm honestly not sure how they haven't been blocked yet. Edit warriors don't usually last this long. Like I said, "'Edit war' appears on his talk page 51 times. That's not even including what he deletes without archiving" He has 3 prior blocks for edit warring. Doesn't seem to have learned much. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:28, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

Nikkimaria has a third way of writing leads. Take a look at how they bungled up John Elway. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:29, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

So we have:

• Bagumba: American former professional football player who was a quarterback in the National Football League (NFL) for 16 seasons.
• Bluerules: American former professional football quarterback who played in the National Football League (NFL) for 16 seasons.
• Nikkimaria (A): American former professional football quarterback who played in the National Football League (NFL) for 16 seasons. (note the unlinked "football")
• Nikkimaria (B): American former football player. A quarterback, he played in the National Football League (NFL) for 16 seasons.
• Nikkimaria (C): American former National Football League (NFL) quarterback for 16 seasons.
• Nikkmaria (D): American former professional football player in the National Football League (NFL) who is considered one of the greatest quarterbacks of all time.
• Nikkmaria (E): American former professional football player. He was a quarterback in the National Football League (NFL) for 18 seasons.

Which one do I pick? If I pick Bagumba or Nikkimaria, Bluerules will revert me. If I pick Bluerules, Nikkimaria will change it to one of their five versions. Nikkimaria doesn't seem to mind the Bagumba version though. Seriously, what do I do? LOL. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:56, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: In light of the World Cup, consider the leads of the other football. —Bagumba (talk) 20:17, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

I'll assume that's a joke, lol. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 20:19, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: I'm not pushing for "footballer", but there's no "football goalie" or "rugby union hooker" to "save" a couple of words. Not to mention that MOS thing. —Bagumba (talk) 20:27, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

Can you tell that to Bluerules? ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 20:29, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Somewhere on the to-do list. I've got other low hanging fruit in the meantime. —Bagumba (talk) 20:32, 6 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9 Seriously, what do I do?: Listen to your heart LOL. —Bagumba (talk) 17:35, 7 July 2026 (UTC)

My heart tells me to just wait until Bluerules gets blocked. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:55, 7 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: "football player who was a" > any other non-SOB version > SOB that saves two words —Bagumba (talk) 17:06, 8 July 2026 (UTC)

Can you tell that to Nikkmaria? ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:11, 8 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: From what I've noticed, she has used "player who was" on pages. I believe it's when people revert that she tries to find a non-SOB compromise. —Bagumba (talk) 17:17, 8 July 2026 (UTC)

Well, Bluerules isn't going to accept those other versions either so she should stop trying to please him. He can't be appeased. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:20, 8 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9 Maybe that's what you're waiting for. —Bagumba (talk) 17:28, 8 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: There's the don't even have a standalone football in the lead, let alone link it, that was one this page from day 1 —Bagumba (talk) 00:22, 19 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Maybe unlinked "football" is a thing. —Bagumba (talk) 06:06, 24 July 2026 (UTC)

It used to be "American football cornerback", now people want to get rid of the sport link entirely? I saw someone else do that yesterday at Nate DeMontagnac....

I found the culprit: Tom Brady. It appears he has had football unlinked since November 2025.

In that scenario, you have to click three links to get to American football. quarterback → Gridiron football → American football Facepalm ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:37, 24 July 2026 (UTC)

"played" "played" "played" ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 13:17, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Nice. And no "Clark enrolled at the University of Louisville to play college football for the Louisville Cardinals". —Bagumba (talk) 18:13, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

Yes, I am known to accept advice unlike some people. LOL ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 18:19, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: We all know that JC ≠ college football lol. Seriously though, at least when "Louisville Cardinals" is already in the lead, we can assume the reader will recall the Cardinals, esp. when "University of Louisville" is right next to it. An arguable exception might be flagship schools like the University of California, Berkeley, with the California Golden Bears. —Bagumba (talk) 18:36, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

I personally haven't been putting JCs in the leads of my recent articles. See Omari Jordan, Chad Brown (defensive end), etc. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 18:46, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Then we don't need to bother finding out the mascot name for Vermilion Community College, where "Vermillion Ironhawks" anyways hides that its a CC, or we avoid a non-symmetric sentence like "played college football at Vermilion Community College and for the Buffalo Bulls". —Bagumba (talk) 18:57, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

"we don't need to bother finding out the mascot name for Vermilion Community College" THIS times 1000. And a lot of the times the mascot name isn't even the same as it was 50 years ago, so you have to go digging through Newspapers.com to find the contemporary name. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 19:05, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

Save your time. It's probably "Indians". —Bagumba (talk) 19:14, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

LOLLL ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 19:16, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

You were right: at Tag Rome, I just had to write Northeast Louisiana Indians. lol ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 18:05, 11 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9 I made it DYK ready. —Bagumba (talk) 23:21, 11 August 2026 (UTC)

Can you make Joe Pellegrini (defensive tackle) "DYK ready" too? Apparently having the exact same name and playing for the same team only a few years apart isn't interesting: Template:Did you know nominations/Joe Pellegrini (defensive tackle). ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:22, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: It's a crap shoot at DYK. Maybe throw in a Joe Biden reference somehow. —Bagumba (talk) 15:16, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't understand the reference.

Re: Pellegrini: Jets.com thought it was interesting: What are the odds that two men named Joe Pellegrini played for the Jets? It happened.

Y10 thought it was too: Lol that's crazy. I couldn't imagine Italians in the 1970s/80s with that name playing for anybody else other than the Jets lol. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 15:24, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

It's a bad reference cuz I don't understand why they're pushing the Abe Lincoln angle over there either. You could ask for a second opinion ({{DYK?again}}) or work with them and mention offense/defense somehow. Good luck. —Bagumba (talk) 16:05, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Yeah, that Lincoln hook is definitely more interesting than Joe Pellegrini... How would listing offense and defense make it more interesting? Their name is either interesting or it isn't. Adding other details just differentiates them more. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 16:44, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

I've found at DYK that reviewers usually end up making the hooks less interesting. The original hook of "... that a brand of cream cheese was created in a small Argentine town?" is more interesting than that Lincoln stuff. My hook for Norm Sonju was "that Norm Sonju co-founded the NBA's Dallas Mavericks?" but it was changed to " ... that former NBA executive Norm Sonju has the floor for the 1986 NBA All-Star Game at his camp in New York?" which only received a paltry 1,760 views. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 16:47, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Someone dumbed down my KFC reference once. We're right, and everyone else is an idiot. Lol. —Bagumba (talk) 16:58, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

KFC is definitely more interesting. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:02, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

I was going to do a hook for "Did you know that New York Giants quarterback Jerry Niles was a dive bomber during World War II?" but I decided not to because I'm sure they would have changed quarterback to "player", which takes the oomph out of the hook (how QBs throw bombs and stuff) Plain old player isn't as interesting. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:03, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: It's a law: If you criticize someone else's hook, consensus will err on side of nominator intent. If someone critiques your hook, the community will override your wishes in the name of WP:DYKINT. —Bagumba (talk) 05:41, 18 August 2026 (UTC)

And I'm not one of those people who try to come up with banal hooks for every article they write. I've written over 2,000 gridiron bios and I only have 53 DYKs. I only nominate something if I actually think it's pretty interesting. I don't see how the Pellegrini hook isn't interesting, lol. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:19, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

LOL ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 19:26, 19 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Pinch hitters don't exist across the pond. But if KFC needs explaining, no hook is off limits Actually, it's amazing how many baseball sayings there are in everyday American English. —Bagumba (talk) 19:54, 19 August 2026 (UTC)

How can someone with 3K edits wave a wand and say it's not interesting? Someone with 48K approved it. I see they support "Queens Park Rangers F.C.", whatever that is. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 19:56, 19 August 2026 (UTC)

I was reading the KFC discussion again... How did ALT4 appear on the main page when the reviewer just threw it in at the end? There was no discussion about it. The reviewer specifically approved ALT3. Facepalm ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 20:16, 19 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Ah, you haven't run across "promoter discretion" before? Or when people that know nothing about sports copyedit it into some bizarre wording, or eff it up with some Engvar change. And how you're often not notified about post-approval changes. There used to be the nom vebiage "Post-promotion hook changes will be logged on the talk page; consider watching the nomination until the hook appears on the Main Page", except that logging script almost never worked. —Bagumba (talk) 21:02, 19 August 2026 (UTC)

Now it was promoted and I didn't even change anything. See Template:Did_you_know/Preparation_area_5#Hooks. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:07, 21 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Maybe was ignored cuz it wasn't marked with one of those symbol things lol. —Bagumba (talk) 04:50, 22 August 2026 (UTC)

"tweak to match source punctuation" yet they added [American] football in brackets which wasn't in the source. lol ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:55, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

It's weird how at the DYK nomination pages, we have these big debates about how to precisely word stuff and what ALTs to approve. Then random people can just come along and change the hook to whatever they want. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:58, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Leave some feedback —Bagumba (talk) 16:59, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

I'd just get lynched like last time. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:00, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

The general comments section is just a "circlejerk" about how he's perfect. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:11, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

Someone opposed. Hopefully they don't get lynched. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 18:15, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

He already has three replies. I thought about leaving a comment along the lines of "Please don't badger. This RfA is obviously going to pass." but decided not to. I'm sure someone would reply to me and try to start a big debate about why this !vote must be discussed. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 19:20, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Sycophants. Consensus doesn't require unanimity. —Bagumba (talk) 20:57, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9 And that $18 million wasn't even mentioned in the body. Then it's "sourced" cuz it's in some citation somewhere? Ultimate non-apology. —Bagumba (talk) 21:19, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

They had to move the oppose discussion to the talk page it became so big. There was no reason to reply to that guy at all. Snowflakes? LOL. Josh said "I appreciate you demonstrating exactly what will make them an excellent administrator." So much sarcasm. How does lying about a mistake make you an excellent administrator??? Re Josh: An excellent administrator would be toning down the situation as my draft reply above would have. Not piling on to a nothingburger. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:08, 25 August 2026 (UTC)

"Ultimate non-apology" Being secretive appears to be par for the course for them though since they had an undisclosed COI for 7 years (see the neutral vote). ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:11, 25 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: They did at least unbury their disclosure (see bottom). —Bagumba (talk) 17:54, 25 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: For better or for worse, RFAs are more kumbaya-ish these days. —Bagumba (talk) 18:22, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

Same reason WP:Admin elections were created. They're less "toxic" (for better or worse) than old RfAs where everyone debated each other to death. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 18:26, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

It's like clockwork. If someone is mucking with WO9's nom, they must be applying for the mop. —Bagumba (talk) 18:19, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

I'm a litmus test. lol ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 18:23, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9 I don't know what that "attribute" means. I used to figure WP:ATTRIBUTEPOV applied to hooks, but its de rigueur for quirkiness. —Bagumba (talk) 17:05, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

Just like how "significant coverage" means a million different things. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:08, 24 August 2026 (UTC)

I'm sure DYK?again would similarly be a crapshoot. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:02, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Try something with these sources:

• In 1981, The Idaho Statesman thought that the center was the same player as the defensive lineman, and that he had just changed positions.
• UPI also noted that the players shared the same name.

—Bagumba (talk) 06:40, 18 August 2026 (UTC)

Those are good sources. Thanks. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:03, 18 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: Truly ready now. —Bagumba (talk) 08:42, 19 August 2026 (UTC)

I found another one: I was reviewing Bob Krieger for GA and the lead says he played college football for the Dartmouth Big Green - NOPE, Dartmouth Indians. LOL. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:42, 14 August 2026 (UTC)

Incidentally, Chad Brown (linebacker) helped me win my fantasy league one year. —Bagumba (talk) 19:00, 30 July 2026 (UTC)

Helpful edits

For the Navy. Also, why did someone replace the image I already uploaded (File:Red Heater.png) with the same thing (File:Red Heater circa 1936.jpg). I don't think the "no copyright notice" stuff is clearly public domain because someone questioned it at Template:Did you know nominations/Emmett Barrett. There was also a discussion I read once about how the copyright notice could be at the front or back of the newspaper...... I can't be that bothered to find that discussion though. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 18:32, 10 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9 Navy: I only know about military base teams from doing some hoops bios around Korean War. Heater: Were they only questioning the PD claim because they didn't have full access to the paper? I've used the lack of copyright notice as a rationale before. The earliest I've seen a paper with a notice is the LA Times in the 60s. I doubt most smaller papers had them back then. —Bagumba (talk) 00:45, 11 August 2026 (UTC)

Does the notice have to be under each individual image? Seriously, I read a discussion once where someone questioned it and said the notice could be in the front or back of the newspaper covering the whole paper. I can't find the discussion though... ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 12:16, 11 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: See © at bottom right of clip from front page of LA Times. It's a no-brainer if its on the image itself. I suppose it can be anywhere in the paper, though I haven't seen an example. I've seen yearbooks with the copyright placed at random places. —Bagumba (talk) 23:19, 11 August 2026 (UTC)

NBA sources question

Does it count as a "breaking news" source if a trade article says that a team "have agreed" to a trade? I'm asking as I saw that the Hornets traded Tre Mann to the Cavaliers for Dennis Schröder and cash, but when I looked at a nba.com article about it, it mentioned that the Hornets "have agreed" to acquire Dennis Schröder and cash considerations from the Cavaliers in exchange for Tre Mann. ReallyAmazingDude13 (talk) 00:30, 15 August 2026 (UTC)

Just say the word

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Pepper_Rodgers&action=history Do you want all these reverted .. with a reason? I won't even use 'rollback', lol. Bringingthewood (talk) 00:28, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

@Bringingthewood: I started a discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College football § Coaching trees. You can discuss or edit as you see fit. —Bagumba (talk) 00:38, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Talk about timing .. you're good. I was just going to use the tree litter link as a reason. Being that no common courtesy message was sent back to you. Bringingthewood (talk) 00:41, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Lol, I don't know what excuse to use. I see JW11 and Jauerback got some already. I used the WP: because I screwed up the direct link. Rollbacking a vandal is much more fun .. just saying. Bringingthewood (talk)

@Bringingthewood: That slink doesn't work in edit summaries, but you figured that out.—Bagumba (talk) 01:37, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Only for you, Lloyd. Bringingthewood (talk) 01:48, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

It doesn't matter, like Forrest said: Life is like a box of chocolates! Bringingthewood (talk) 01:26, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

@Bringingthewood:: Lieutenant Dan!—Bagumba (talk) 01:37, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Second opinion for ITN image

Hi, may I ask for a second opinion on the suitability of this image for ITN? The uploader has a history of earthquake images being deleted on Commons for copyvio, and I'm not previously familiar with this license, but from what I can tell reading the relevant rules, everything seems fine. FWIW, it lacks metadata which you've previously told me is a possibly suspicious tell. Your second opinion would be assuring either way, thanks. (p.s. any general tips you have for expediting these types of judgments would be helpful too) Left guide (talk) 03:25, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

@Left guide: The uploader doesn't claim it's their image, and they list the source URL, so there's no concern that they got this from social media and are passing it off as their own. So it comes down to whether that PD license claim is applicaable. The image is seemingly from Indonesia, and I'm not readily familiar with their government agencies and whether it applies to this one. And I have no idea what the discussion at c:Template_talk:PD-IDGov#References_to_recent_discussions means exactly, but you should know it's there if you're going to post it. —Bagumba (talk) 05:19, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Clothesline

I saw this term in a newspaper article over the weekend and when I started looking for a meaning, I ended up in the Kurt Rambis article. Since I didn't know what it meant, I thought a link to the term was useful.— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 17:24, 17 August 2026 (UTC)

Hi @Vchimpanzee. Understandable. The reason I reverted is twofold: It's not necessarily a wrestling move, where it was previously linked to, and it seems like a basic English term from its Merriam-Webster definition. Basic English terms are generally not linked, and there's no other relevant Wikipedia article. I did add a Wiktionary link to Clothesline (disambiguation). Regards.—Bagumba (talk) 03:13, 18 August 2026 (UTC)

The wrestling article was the closest thing. I know little about sports but Kurt Rambis was a big deal where I live. We had an NBA team!— Vchimpanzee • talk • contributions • 21:18, 18 August 2026 (UTC)

Jill Gomez

story · music · places

Thinking of you. I had three bios in the news section when the day began, and Jill Gomez is my favourite, - my story of course! Thank you for bringing Violet Hensley to the main page, - don't miss the NYT obit that appeared only afterwards, - it's fun! - Places are particularly bright today: for a Voces8 concert you would have loved. -- Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:09, 18 August 2026 (UTC)

@Gerda Arendt: You're welcome. Posting is the easy part compared to the page updates ;-) —Bagumba (talk) 23:05, 18 August 2026 (UTC)

ITN recognition for O. J. Brigance

On 19 August 2026, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article O. J. Brigance, which you updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. Spencer^T•C 03:00, 19 August 2026 (UTC)

NFL Kickoff Game

Is it going to get moved back again next year? See the two RMs. lol. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 17:12, 21 August 2026 (UTC)

@WikiOriginal-9: I'm betting lowercase "game" on Kalshi. —Bagumba (talk) 04:51, 22 August 2026 (UTC)

ITN recognition for Frank Beard (drummer)

On 23 August 2026, In the news was updated with an item that involved the article Frank Beard (drummer), which you updated. If you know of another recently created or updated article suitable for inclusion in ITN, please suggest it on the candidates page. Schwede66 16:37, 23 August 2026 (UTC)

Did you know...

... that Faddie Tillman was noted for his habit of catching his breath by holding his head high to "let more air through" and also singing "Popeye The Sailor Man" to the other players? I don't feel like doing a DYK so I'll post it on your talkpage instead for my amusement. ~WikiOriginal-9~ (talk) 19:09, 25 August 2026 (UTC)